TorontoBuilder
Ultra Member
My buddy Brian and I have plans for an ELS project once our tachometer and surface feet per minute calculator are done. It will turn tapers, and concave and convex surfaces
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When does it start violating the rules, IF I were to....
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The other thing about it is that I want to check one box and order a complete 'kit' . I am not up to speed on steppers, stepper drivers, etc. Like everything else, I could get obsessed with it and spend months learning everything about it. I just don't have time these days. I want them to say what size is your lathe? Here's the kit you want, you pay now, we send.
TorontoBuilder
Ultra Member
I really like the Rocketronics version, except the price and the encoder pendant. you need to replace the hand wheels so it feels natural in manual mode
TorontoBuilder
Ultra Member
That is the ultimate goal of my friend and I... bang here is your complete package, here are your instructional videos and manual. Here is the number of your installation coach if required... I see demand being in the 10x20 to 12x36 lathe market
TorontoBuilder
Ultra Member
what test bed do you have? I need an idea of the torque required for steppers or servo motors
I'm so glad I made the acquaintance of my friend Brian. He has the skills I lack and an electronics lab in his home, does surface mount stuff in sizes I can't even see. And programming.
Dabbler
ersatz engineer
They have a setting to stop power to the motors, That way the machine is still fully manual. No need to take the had wheels off. Only when power is applied, the pendant is needed...
Hate to be such a downer about this but after almost 2 decades of experience with developing, building and selling ELS kits the one thing you can be sure of is that the market is not what you think it is.
Also the costs of everything are going up which will include tariff barriers against getting things made in China. Sure you can get cheap stepper motors and drivers and power supplies but when you start looking at completed kits for say a CNC kit for a mill or lathe that power supply, motor driver, connector set all assembled and ready to go jacks the price way up.
And then every lathe is different requiring different sensors, switches, motor pulleys etc. so which lathe will you target first? You can't afford to make the brackets and mounts by hand. Must be CNC. So how many do you make per setup? For 10 kits? You sell two and then the other 8 sit until you realize the reason yours isn't selling is because someone else is now making a kit that has one feature different from yours and people are buying into that.
What actually happens is someone decides to make a different one. They sell the 10 to 25 prototypes they had made and then they are bored with ELS kits and move onto new projects. No new development. No long term support.
It's' a throw away world now.
TorontoBuilder
Ultra Member
OOH I like that.
TorontoBuilder
Ultra Member
Yes I recognize that is all true.
But in the end we are doing the project to convert our own lathes, which was to be our 12x37 and Brians 10x22, and the parts except drives would be common to a range of similar lathes, and we are not looking to be profitable business in this regard, just to serve interested people at the same time
Will there be long term support for ours, nope, but there will be enough to get those that are interested running...
Hell I see a ton of old commercial cnc machines on the market that are basically scrap because lack of support and parts.
Our goal is simple as possible smart lathe... aka servo lathe because homebuilt cnc lathes I've seen all ended up trash
I'm currently looking for a decent older CNC lathe that requires a control retrofit. Can you tell me where you are seeing them for sale? Preferably in Eastern Canada.
gerritv
Gerrit
Rocketronics does indeed ship to Canada. I have an ELS Pro on my King KC1022ML and absolutely love it. Example (0.005mm/rev) https://www.instagram.com/p/ClkYPVjMZ2Z/
I built and used a Russian ELS 7e2 for a few months but it was lacking. So are pretty much all the other offerings in one way or another.
Rocketronics is working on inferial for the ELS, I will ping them soon on an ETA. Doing the conversions on a cheat sheet that I would do anyway makes it less effort.
On the Z I use a Nema 23 with 2:1 reduction, I think it is 2.8NM. On X is a whimpy Nema23 with 1:1. My X axis was extended out the back, motor is mounted using WadeO's design. My most ambitious CNC effort so far.
gerritv
Gerrit
You don't need the pendant, I bought the expansion board (which is inside their pendant) and will be using that with an MPG to do my own things. Check out the expansion board manual on their web site.
My lathe is still fully manual if I so desire, the ELS is there when I need it. No plans to do the full WadeO thing and go feed-by-wire.
gerritv
Gerrit
I disable the stepper driver, (ELS has a button for that) and while you get a detent every 1.8 it is not noticeable in what work I do. I might eventually do a manual disconnect by using pins to connect the pulley with a bushing on the shaft.
The WadeO attchment is overly complex, in hind sight a plate bolted to back of carriage with a bearing for the X extension, and 4 standoffs to mount the motor would be fine. But it was fun doing the CNC thing.
I have tested power parting off with this, works well but still a bit of a pucker factor.
The WadeO attchment is overly complex, in hind sight a plate bolted to back of carriage with a bearing for the X extension, and 4 standoffs to mount the motor would be fine. But it was fun doing the CNC thing.
I have tested power parting off with this, works well but still a bit of a pucker factor.
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Matt-Aburg
Ultra Member
I was reading in about the ELS last night. I did not realize that the Chinese had cheapened out on hobby lathes by dropping the feed bar. I see many that are only with a lead screw. Is this why you would want to do the ELS? I want to introduce a different idea. This might be able to apply to the new style hobby lathes or any conventional lathe.
First of all, I will show the product that I have had for over 12 years. It is a 1440 lathe from CNC Masters in Sunny California. This is an Birmingham Lathe that was converted. (all his machines are imports starting with a (Birmingham). My particular machine was one of the first 1440 lathes he built. It has a 3 HP motor. The new models are 2 HP. Basically how it works is you turn off the feed bar and lead screw, engage a lever, and then use the CNC controlled ballscrews. If you were going to copy this idea I would really consider using a Masso controller instead.
See links below. I will post pictures of the ballscrews and how it is tied in.
www.cncmasters.com
docs.masso.com.au
First of all, I will show the product that I have had for over 12 years. It is a 1440 lathe from CNC Masters in Sunny California. This is an Birmingham Lathe that was converted. (all his machines are imports starting with a (Birmingham). My particular machine was one of the first 1440 lathes he built. It has a 3 HP motor. The new models are 2 HP. Basically how it works is you turn off the feed bar and lead screw, engage a lever, and then use the CNC controlled ballscrews. If you were going to copy this idea I would really consider using a Masso controller instead.
See links below. I will post pictures of the ballscrews and how it is tied in.
1440 CNC Lathe Machine | CNC Masters
The 1440 CNC Lathe has the ability to revert to manual control quickly and efficiently, eliminating the need to write a CNC program for short runs.
www.cncmasters.com
Setup MASSO Lathe
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