Quick change insert height

[gerritv]

It's more fun to chase tenths when the dimension on the drawing is a fraction.
Doesn't apply as much to metric of course where everything is already in mm or portions thereof.

This is a good reminder of what is needed (imperial of course)

 

[MrWhoopee]

If you ever work in a place where they are dragging junk in the door to be fixed every day, you would realize that hobby machinists are very often way more anal and whimper on about a 1/2 thou.

I see it all the time on these forums. I believe it is simply because the hobbyists have no real-world concept of what is required and expect everything to be within .001.

I've never owned a tenth indicator. Occasionally I am tempted to buy one. Then I remind myself that nothing I do requires that level of accuracy and none of my machines are capable of producing it.

 

[KeeponDragon]

I was wondering...what was the solution to this dilemma ?
Staring at my acquisition...I did a quick "how to measure for a QCTP" and the top of my compound is honestly just an inch to the centerline of the chuck...according to Accusize's pages...that would mean a BXA post...
But that seems a tick small for a 15" swing...
Reading the comments...I wouldn't doubt the compound is a bit too tall for this lathe...
Luckily I'm a little while away yet from pulling the trigger on a post set...
I just want to get the right one the first time

 

[Susquatch]

Staring at my acquisition...I did a quick "how to measure for a QCTP" and the top of my compound is honestly just an inch to the centerline of the chuck...according to Accusize's pages...that would mean a BXA post...

Assuming you measured correctly and are not out by a tenth of a thou low (sorry, couldn't help myself given the conversation above), that seems low for a 15" swing to me too. But I have no particular expertise on the matter. I'm just a dumb old engineer noodling your question.

I think we all expect a tool post to scale with swing, but there is nothing that dictates this. Especially for very old lathes most of which were built to accommodate old rocker style toolposts. It's entirely conceivable to me that old 6" swing lathes had the same rocker tool posts that 12" had and 10" was the same as 20" and so on......

But that's all speculation. Yours has 1 inch. To me, that suggests a BXA tool post and 5/8ths tools are maximum. The bottom of the tool holder has to be beefy enough to support the tool. So for a tool holder mounted at the bottom of its travel, you would have a skooch less than 3/8 of tool holder support to put the top of a 5/8 tool on center at 1 inch with a skooch of adjustment. And you would prolly use mostly 1/2 inch tools for good adjustment.

Ya, you would think that a 15" swing would/could use 1 inch tools. But it's old and they prolly didn't know about BXA or CXA way back then.

Also, those older lathes were not nearly as beefy as their swing might suggest. So it's reasonable to be thinking about smaller tools in them than you might otherwise be using on a newer lathe with that much swing.

The other thing is that it's a big mistake to think about BXA as small. A BXA will easily take 50 thou cuts without flailing on you. We are not production shops - we are hobbiests. As a hobbiest, most of your work will be more like 20 or 30 thou cuts, not 100. So I would not fuss about it. It is what it is. Put a BXA on it and enjoy using it.

That's how I would look at it anyway. I have a BXA sized system and I love it. It's plenty beefy enough for all my hobby work.

 

[KeeponDragon]

Also, those older lathes were not nearly as beefy as their swing might suggest. So it's reasonable to be thinking about smaller tools in them than you might otherwise be using on a newer lathe with that much swing.

This makes total sense. Being a noob, with a new ginormous toy, I assumed it would take a huge setup as well.
Thanks for the input

 

[Susquatch]

This makes total sense. Being a noob, with a new ginormous toy, I assumed it would take a huge setup as well.
Thanks for the input

Also celebrate that your tooling won't require a billion dollar budget. You will only need a million dollars....... LOL!

 

[KeeponDragon]

Ya, you would think that a 15" swing would/could use 1 inch tools. But it's old and they prolly didn't know about BXA or CXA way back then.

For it's age, I'd bet money it had a lantern style post.

Assuming you measured correctly and are not out by a tenth of a thou low (sorry, couldn't help myself given the conversation above), that seems low for a 15" swing to me too.

I wouldn't claim to be exact...but basically, I put a broom handle in the chuck, rolled the carriage under it and used a tape measure from the center of the stick to the base of the 4 way tool post...
IF I could get the tail stock up on the bed myself...I'd use it as well to measure...but I don't have a dead center for it.
I do have a long bar with a taper on it, that has square holes with set screws...must be for boring??
I need to measure it up for what MT this old girl has

ALSO...I believe this rig has a taper attachement as well...I'll post pics once I get it set up...it's an odd looking contrivance

 

[KeeponDragon]

Also celebrate that your tooling won't require a billion dollar budget. You will only need a million dollars....... LOL!

you are not wrong there...it's seemingly insane to me how much the costs seemingly double with one upsize...yikes!

 

[Susquatch]

you are not wrong there...it's seemingly insane to me how much the costs seemingly double with one upsize...yikes!

Please don't buy one of those kits with 10 crappy tools in them. Total waste of money that every new nXA user buys. We all do that and most of us, regret it. Buy a GOOD tool one-at-a-time as you need them. I think most guys on here would agree with that.

And my advice is to start with HSS - but lots of guys on here would disagree with that. It's prolly close to 50/50. I'm just putting my vote out early..... LOL! Might be worth a survey........

 

[KeeponDragon]

Please don't buy one of those kits with 10 crappy tools in them. Total waste of money that every new nXA user buys. We all do that and most of us, regret it. Buy a GOOD tool one-at-a-time as you need them. I think most guys on here would agree with that.

And my advice is to start with HSS - but lots of guys on here would disagree with that. It's prolly close to 50/50. I'm just putting my vote out early..... LOL! Might be worth a survey........

uhm...too late??...lol
I did some looking around, and have selected a BXA kit from Bostar, through ebay. Still Asian made stuff, but the reviews were very good. Comparable to Accusize by what I read.
When I sold the 9x20...I sent the AXA post and holders with it of course...but I kept the tools...which are insert type...all 1/2 inch...
It was a lot of farting around to find good inserts for my budget and purposes...so I felt justified keeping them...
I do have some HSS tools as well...but it's the sharpening of them that confounds me with the multiple faces and angles...I'm not patient enough if I'm honest...lol

 

[Bandit]

You can use smaller tooling to do various work. The bigger carbide is more money, no 2 ways about that! With bigger carbide, if the bit get broke, worn, and results in replacement before " a good amount" of work done, the cost is not worth it! A lot of carbide needs higher speeds and deeper, heavier feeds to give good surface finish.
Follow Susquatch's and some others trials and findings in their journeys down the carbide trail. While you have an older, bigger machine , it may not mean big heavy cuts, but it does mean a bigger swing in many cases.
And hey, its " just a hobby", right? We don't need 1/2 inch X 1/8 chips coming off her do we?

 

[Susquatch]

uhm...too late??...lol
I did some looking around, and have selected a BXA kit from Bostar, through ebay. Still Asian made stuff, but the reviews were very good. Comparable to Accusize by what I read.

When I talked about kits, I wasn't talking about the toolpost. I was talking about the tools themselves - RH, LH, parting, threading, chamfer, grooving, etc etc. Sounds like you already wasted your money on those before.....LOL!

I think it's fine to buy a tool post set.

When I sold the 9x20...I sent the AXA post and holders with it of course...but I kept the tools...which are insert type...all 1/2 inch...
It was a lot of farting around to find good inserts for my budget and purposes...so I felt justified keeping them...

Yup, and now you can still use them with your new BXA Tool Post set.

I do have some HSS tools as well...but it's the sharpening of them that confounds me with the multiple faces and angles...I'm not patient enough if I'm honest...lol

Of course it is confounding. But it's the learning you acquire doing it that matters, not the time or patience required. The time and patience is not an investment in your lathe or your tools. It Is an investment in YOURSELF! In my mind there is no better investment you can make in yourself than the learning and skills you gather. The time is not wasted, it is priceless.

 

[Dabbler]

@KeeponDragon I have a 15" as well. I can use BXA or CXA on it. It uses the 4.5 inch Enco 4-way in the 1.25 inch size, and takes the 00mm Dixon toolpost.

My distance is 1.75" from centreline to the compound flat - not much more than yours. Both the BXA and the CXA have between 1/2" and 5/8" lip below the tool.

Here's a suggestion: if you have a member near you that you'd like to meet,have them come over with their BXA and put it in place with a holder and see how it fits... No need for a T nut or post, just place it there and eyeball the fit.

 

[Susquatch]

Here's a suggestion: if you have a member near you that you'd like to meet,have them come over with their BXA and put it in place with a holder and see how it fits... No need for a T nut or post, just place it there and eyeball the fit.

Or even make a wooden one from somebody's dimensions. I'll happily measure my BXA for you!

 

[KeeponDragon]

Here's a suggestion: if you have a member near you that you'd like to meet,have them come over with their BXA and put it in place with a holder and see how it fits...

I think I'm pretty solitary here in the Okanagan...so far as membership goes...
but that's ok...I do appreciate everyone's help!

 

[Susquatch]

2.75 - Total height of toolpost
0.50 - Bottom ledge of 5/8 holder
0.43 - bottom ledge of 3/4 holder
1.33 - top of compound to lathe centerline.

I think the scary number there is the third of an inch more room than you have assuming your 1 inch is correct. That might force you into 1/2 inch tools - which you already have so no biggie! But you could also mill down your holders to take some off the bottom as needed. You won't know till you do the measurements and the math.

The only other choice is to go to an AXA - Which I wouldn't do if I were you.

If you make a wooden model, go ahead and cut a ledge into it at 0.5 and 0.43 to simulate regular 5/8 and tall 3/4 inch holders.

Looking at my holder rack, you can get an idea of my adjustments. They vary quite a bit depending on the tools and their size.

 

[TorontoBuilder]

2.75 - Total height of toolpost
0.50 - Bottom ledge of 5/8 holder
0.43 - bottom ledge of 3/4 holder
1.33 - top of compound to lathe centerline.

I think the scary number there is the third of an inch more room than you have assuming your 1 inch is correct. That might force you into 1/2 inch tools - which you already have so no biggie! But you could also mill down your holders to take some off the bottom as needed. You won't know till you do the measurements and the math.

The only other choice is to go to an AXA - Which I wouldn't do if I were you.

If you make a wooden model, go ahead and cut a ledge into it at 0.5 and 0.43 to simulate regular 5/8 and tall 3/4 inch holders.

Looking at my holder rack, you can get an idea of my adjustments. They vary quite a bit depending on the tools and their size.

View attachment 50893

damn you may have more holders than us.

i need to make some more asap

 

[Susquatch]

damn you may have more holders than us.

i need to make some more asap

I grow my tool holders by about 6 a month..... I've been known to go look a Kijiji item I had no interest in just cuz I saw tool holders in the background and wanted an excuse to get a closer look and make an offer.

And then there are the bulk buy discounts.

I think tool holders is the main reason why carbide inserts are not the bargain everyone thinks they are. It's not the price of the car, it's the options that kill you!

 

[KeeponDragon]

I grow my tool holders by about 6 a month.....

what kind of fertilizer do you use for that? something that fosters good alloy growth or??

 

[combustable herbage]

Monometallic manifestation