Shop Shop air line systems

[Dabbler]

Thanks for all your thoughts guys.

One more idea: at the end of your run, set it up for an additional length, then stopper it. If you find your flow is anemic, you can connect the *other* end to your supply, providing a ring or loop - giving 2 paths for the flow to source from. This is very common in high volume air systems in industry.

 

[mbond]

Adding perhaps unnecessary detail, all pipes that are made of ductile material can fail this way. Plastics are the obvious material that can fail this way, but so can copper or steel under the right conditions

And all sorts of compression fittings self seal this way too. Lots of automotive and aviation stuff

 

[Darren]

John, my system is pretty basic, and actual needs aren't that high. The blast cabinet will get its own home-run line. I'm actually thinking about lifting the 80gallon horizontal compressor up to a platform and putting the blast cabinet underneath. The copper cooler, main reg, filter and lubricator will be mounted to the wall right there too. .

The main usage is for my daily work on the vehicle lifts. Those will be serviced with a 3/4" mainline with 1/2" drops, to the 4x 3/8"id x 25ft hoses.

I'm getting by right now with a 3/8 hose on the floor, with no real performance issues. Hoses on the floor take a beating, and I trip over them. Its time for a permanent install, thats all.

That, and I want a permanent line to the machine shop area, which is 50' from the compressor, to service the power drawbar and blowgun at the mill. Right now I have a small compressor sitting behind the mill and its a pain in the ass.

 

[Darren]

Adding perhaps unnecessary detail, all pipes that are made of ductile material can fail this way. Plastics are the obvious material that can fail this way, but so can copper or steel under the right conditions

And all sorts of compression fittings self seal this way too. Lots of automotive and aviation stuff

I did a CPVC system in a shop about 15 years ago. Trust me, it was not my idea, but its still working fine.

I'm pretty familiar with compression fittings in automotive/truck applications. I use them on brake lines all the time.





(air brakes)

 

[mbond]

I thought It was probably unnecessary

 

[Darren]

I was looking at some maxline reviews and stuff, and a ton of people complain about leaks at the double o-ringed compression fittings. I couldn't understand it until i watched a few videos. Some of these guys posting video tutorials should probably find something else to do.

 

[Doggggboy]

Here's one of many things I did not know regarding PEX.
A vs B

 

[Brian H]

I've learned to hate PEX water lines SOOOO MUCH, you would have to connect me to 24kv through each testicle to get me to try running air that way.

My whole house is pex water. It is constantly leaking someplace. I just finished installing a fancy new laundry tub for my wife. The water connections were those new pex push-to-connect fittings. God awful design that sprayed water everywhere. Had to resort to new shutoffs with crimp on connectors. Didn't matter what I did, they failed the go-no-go test. I finally just tightened the collar and resigned myself to the possibility of another future leak.

Copper or galvanized might cost more, but that's what I'd be doing if I were you. My own choice would be copper.

That's an out of the ordinary experience for me. I've been in the home reno/building trade for close to 2 decades and other than an apprentice having a poor/ loose crimp I've never had a pex line leak at a connection. The shark-bite style push on connectors are a bit fussy with square clean cuts and pushing on square. If that is done I haven't had an issue (I wouldn't put one in a wall tho).
I had a pex air line in my shop for a few years and only chose to switch it with a different system when I had to add drops (and the kit was really cheap at PA)

 

[Brian H]

Here's one of many things I did not know regarding PEX.
A vs B

I didn't watch the video, but, I would never use those crimp rings on a pex line...that could be why they are leaking. If you use the proper pex crimp rings (copper) and crimping pliers you won't have an issue.
Just my .02

 

[Hruul]

Interesting. My house is done in PEX A. When I spliced into it for the basement renovation about 9 years ago I used what he is calling PEX B. I used brass fittings and copper crimp rings. No leaks so far and no pressure issues.

 

[Darren]

If Sharkbite connectors were cheaper, I'd do the whole system with them. No different than any push to connect air fitting on commercial trucks. I would not use them on residential plumbing though, except the one time i had to because the 1/2" copper stub for the toilet was too short and it was the only solution. It worked, never leaked, but never trusted it as much as i wanted to. If that makes sense.

If a sharkbite fails on an air system, its not going to flood my shop. I will be using copper crimp rings on the air system. I don't trust the Oetiker clamps either.

 

[Brian H]

If Sharkbite connectors were cheaper, I'd do the whole system with them. No different than any push to connect air fitting on commercial trucks. I would not use them on residential plumbing though, except the one time i had to because the 1/2" copper stub for the toilet was too short and it was the only solution. It worked, never leaked, but never trusted it as much as i wanted to. If that makes sense.

If a sharkbite fails on an air system, its not going to flood my shop.

I use them in an "emergency" when I have a leaking shut off on a job site so we don't flood a customers house but I always have the plumbers install a new shut off at the final part of the project.
I have never tried them with air so I'm not sure how the seal would stand up to 90-120 psi. Not an issue till your not around and your compressor doesn't shut off...LOL

 

[DPittman]

Interesting. My house is done in PEX A. When I spliced into it for the basement renovation about 9 years ago I used what he is calling PEX B. I used brass fittings and copper crimp rings. No leaks so far and no pressure issues.

Yes I know that's been done lots and likewise haven't heard of problems.

 

[Darren]

I use them in an "emergency" when I have a leaking shut off on a job site so we don't flood a customers house but I always have the plumbers install a new shut off at the final part of the project.
I have never tried them with air so I'm not sure how the seal would stand up to 90-120 psi. Not an issue till your not around and your compressor doesn't shut off...LOL

I have some devices called "excess flow valves". They work like a check valve. If they hit a certain cfm they block flow. I have several from 15 to 35 cfm as I recall. So if a hose blows, they stop the leak.

 

[Doggggboy]

One more idea: at the end of your run, set it up for an additional length, then stopper it. If you find your flow is anemic, you can connect the *other* end to your supply, providing a ring or loop - giving 2 paths for the flow to source from. This is very common in high volume air systems in industry.

So it would connect both ends of the loop to a T fitting on the supply? and this would increase the CFM or the pressure? Or both?

 

[Darren]

Also, as part of the air system upgrade, the one thing i've been meaning to do is install a relay to the mag starter so that the compressor can't start if the lights are off. I think thats the most important safety device i could install. Mostly it would protect my hydro bill....

 

[jorogi]

Also, as part of the air system upgrade, the one thing i've been meaning to do is install a relay to the mag starter so that the compressor can't start if the lights are off. I think thats the most important safety device i could install. Mostly it would protect my hydro bill....

I've been planning that too. Also the sweetie gets a little ticked when the compressor kicks on at 03:00.

 

[Darren]

I wish that was a problem. My shop is almost 200' from my house. If the compressor was running steady, nobody would hear it. Got back from Florida in March and heard a loud squealing. Thought it was the comp, trying to start with a locked up pump or something. It was actually my TV freaking out after a wind storm.

 

[Dabbler]

and this would increase the CFM or the pressure? Or both?

It allows for better flow. thus more cfm. it essentially doubles the supply tubes to the active drop.

 

[wmetfab]

Ive been doing plumbing work since I renovated the family bathroom in 1978. I watched plumbers solder when I was a kid and was fascinated by it, I learned how and it was super easy, joint has to be super clean by abrasion and well fluxed, no problems. In multiple buildings ive plumbed over the years Ive never had 1 joint failure. My buddy's house had poly b and hes had leaks everywhere, as we know now, it was complete shit. So I dont trust any plastic.

I remember the Texaco gas and garage where my dad had the car fixed, It had copper lines for the air. So that must have been good.

My current place, the compressor, A Devilbis 10hp. 3 phase is in a compressor room 8x8 with concrete block walls and a vent for air draw and cooling The main lines out are 1-1/4 galv steel and they go under the slab to several risers and a line goes about 100ft to building #2.
Outside anything exposed is galvanized, anything inside is black iron, painted blue.
Ive plumbed 1000's of ft of iron pipe in mills when I worked in them

Ive seen some backyard guys around use white PVC farm irrigation pipe, if sch. 40 is used, primed and glued properly its good for 160 psi water.
Ive installed 1000's of ft. Of PVC on various farms, so theres another option.

Each outlet has a T, a 6" drop leg with a small drain valve for garbage and condensation and a horizontal nipple with1 1/2" valve before the quick fitting. I dont leave any hoses plugged in overnight.
For me, anything other than iron pipe for air lines is not a consideration at all, IDK about the new plastic but it has to be rated for at least 160psi.

If one wants to keep the compressor off at night could use a good timer, GE or square D and a relay if 3 phase

So theres my .02 (..1.45 USD)
Hope this is any help to others