10” Utilathe (Miss Metric) Overhaul Repair

[Brent H]

@6.5 Fan : yes, it is very fascinating how it is supposedly a metric lathe. The threading dial needs to fit onto the lathe and the lead screw is 7/8” diameter with 4mm pitch threads. The distance from the centre of the pivot point to the centre of the gear teeth is maintained at 4.000”.

@Johnwa measured all the gears for me and they work out to DP20. I measured up his threading dial and that all worked out perfectly in Imperial measure. So much for the metric system.

I have a service manual for my 1970 German built (metric) car and it is all in inches and foot pounds -LOL.

@Susquatch : I have a spring loaded diamond tip engraving tool and will use the rotary table on the mill. For my dial I really only need the scribed lines as I am not adding the other gears and only need to engage on opposite lines. I figure adding more indexing lines will be confusing. The gears are to line up such that the gear is on the threads of the lead screw and the indication lines match.

 

[140mower]

I keep thinking about buying a cheap 10 TPI lead screw for my Mill Drill and adding new dials. Id do it mostly to improve the selling price, but with proper dials and lead screw, I might even want to keep it......

What is the best way (or at least a good way) to mark the dials for the gradations?

Dividing head and a shaper......

 

[Johnwa]

@Johnwa : would it be possible to get these 2 measurements? The big one would be from the centre line of the gear shaft to the centre line of the bolt holes.




I totally measured the crap out of that when we met up at Robinhood’s but missed those two.

I won’t be able to measure these until the first week of April. I might have it in a Fusion drawing but my account has expired. I’m attempting to renew but……

 

[Brent H]

@Johnwa - no worries good sir - I was able to extrapolate from scaling the drawings and measurements I had taken. Thank you !!

 

[Susquatch]

You’ll need a way to index the dial face to the number of graduations. Then you need a way engrave the graduations/numbers.

If you have a way to index the lathe spindle, you could use it together with an engraving tool held in the tool post. A DH and a milling machine will work. In both cases you’ll have to use number stamps if you want digits on your dial.

A pantograph with a DH, number templates, and an engraving tool would be the old school, preferred method. A CNC mill with a 5th axis would be the modern way.

I think I need to find a way to think "mill" for projects like this. I have a universal dividing head and a dividing 5C Collet Holder that I got way back when with my mill/drill, and I recently acquired a 10" rotary table.

No CNC here. Prolly not till my wife pushes me in the hole and finds a younger more talented fellow to use my shop.

Quite obviously you are right about doing it that way on the mill.

I have a spring loaded diamond tip engraving tool and will use the rotary table on the mill.

I assume that spring loaded diamond bit goes into the mill. If so, where does one find such an animal?

@140mower - no shaper here either. Same story as CNC.

Lucky guy will get a fantastic lover, a great cook, a shop full of old fashioned tools, and a farm to live off of too!

 

[140mower]

You can also do it in the lathe by indexing the spindle and putting the lines in by running the carriage up against a hard stop. This is of course done by hand and not under power......

 

[Brent H]

It was $10 cheaper and no shipping cost when I got it. I want to use it to also engrave the measurements into my tailstock shaft and I have another dial plan thing project I am working on ….

 

[Susquatch]

View attachment 21953
It was $10 cheaper and no shipping cost when I got it. I want to use it to also engrave the measurements into my tailstock shaft and I have another dial plan thing project I am working on ….

OK, no shipping cost for me either. It's worth the extra $10 if it works.

I gather you align the thing, load the spring, and then drag it back and forth until happy with the line it makes. Then realign and do the next mark, etc.

Now I'm wondering if a spinning diamond burr might work too.....

 

[Brent H]

A while ago @05plsrt4 reached out for some 10” Utilathe parts. I will be making some gears and a new shaft - this will also tie in with @architect who needs the same shaft for his 11”. Maybe I will make 3? Who knows. Anyway the original parts arrived on Thursday and were checked out - gears were pretty worn and lots of sharp edges. I already have one made up and the next one to build is the double gear that sports a bronze bush gear and a larger gear for the feed.

It is alway great to see quality. This gear is put together very well and will be restored to original. A nice set screw retains the press fit bronze gear from rotation. Removed the set screw and pressed out the gear. The gears all look and test to be 16 DP with 14-1/5 PA so that is great. I am waiting on a gear profile/pitch gauge but should be fine. Other gears are looking similar.

Should be a cool project. Anyone sitting on some 16 DP x 20PA cutters and would like to help me out I would send them back sharpened. - there is a chance the 17 tooth shaft gear is 20PA and I don’t have that cutter.

 

[Susquatch]

A while ago @05plsrt4 reached out for some 10” Utilathe parts. I will be making some gears and a new shaft - this will also tie in with @architect who needs the same shaft for his 11”. Maybe I will make 3? Who knows. Anyway the original parts arrived on Thursday and were checked out - gears were pretty worn and lots of sharp edges. I already have one made up and the next one to build is the double gear that sports a bronze bush gear and a larger gear for the feed.

It is alway great to see quality. This gear is put together very well and will be restored to original. A nice set screw retains the press fit bronze gear from rotation. Removed the set screw and pressed out the gear. The gears all look and test to be 16 DP with 14-1/5 PA so that is great. I am waiting on a gear profile/pitch gauge but should be fine. Other gears are looking similar.

View attachment 22145
View attachment 22146
View attachment 22147

Should be a cool project. Anyone sitting on some 16 DP x 20PA cutters and would like to help me out I would send them back sharpened. - there is a chance the 17 tooth shaft gear is 20PA and I don’t have that cutter.

I have a whole box full of gear cutters I got at an auction. I've only ever used one of them to make a new pinion to fit the rack on my mill/drill. I'll look and see if I have what you need. Happy to loan one to you if I have it.

 

[Brent H]

Miss Metric will get some jewelry!

Wedge style tool post $220 off Amazon

Unboxing it looks ok - will machine the base and fit it to see.

 

[YYCHM]

That's the same one I got. Same price as well. I'm quite happy with it.

 

[Brent H]

Great minds Craig!!

If you find it opens too far you can adjust that with the set screw on the one jaw. Takes some time to get it set. - steel seems to be quite hard. My carbide insert end mill is not liking it ….. hmmmm

 

[Susquatch]

Seems hard to cut it stuff is popping up everywhere lately!

 

[YYCHM]

Great minds Craig!!

If you find it opens too far you can adjust that with the set screw on the one jaw. Takes some time to get it set. - steel seems to be quite hard. My carbide insert end mill is not liking it ….. hmmmm

Need a pic please.

 

[Brent H]

Have to be tomorrow- stand by for that excitement

 

[YYCHM]

Have to be tomorrow- stand by for that excitement

Is the set screw something that's already there or something you installed? How do you disassemble one of these things?

 

[Brent H]

Set screw is there - will post you some pics tomorrow

 

[Brent H]

@YYCHM : here you go. So when you want to undo the tool post the handle may have a tendency to rotate to far and into your tool removal process. I adjusted mine so it stops before the wedge.

With the tool post removed you can undo the wedge to the point the wedges will drop out. Depending on where the worm catches the wedges will dictate where the handle stops. If you open up your wedges and the handle stops overtop of the one dovetail it can be a PITA.

Using a combination of where the wedge starts turning in on the worm and the set screw (down below) you can adjust the tool post to stop at a good spot.

Finished machining up the base plate for a nice fit.

The handle tightens up right in a good spot out of the way and releases the tools properly.

Craig, if you go to nuts backing out the wedges it will possibly change where they thread in and it will move the position of the locking handle. I played around to find a good spot, carefully took it apart making sure to keep the rotation on the handle - adjusted the set screw. Took a couple times.

 

[Brent H]

Some projects on Miss Metric!

A while ago a new member @05plsrt4 asked If I could make him some parts to restore his 10” Utilathe - well of course we can do that!!!

Over the past month and a bit we have been emailing and he sent me the required parts. The input gear shaft, the 50 RPM drive gear (it is part of the shaft) and a couple other gears to make up.

I ordered some cutters (still waiting on them) as the gears (once checked very carefully) are 20° pressure angle and are 16 DP. Turns out the 20° pressure angle cutters (other than hobbing ones) are hard to find. I have the #6 cutter coming from England, and 3 other cutters when KBC tools gets their act together.

Making the sliding shaft gear and the shaft out of 4140. The other gears for the feed are bronze and cast iron.

Reaming to 7/8”

Perfect fit !

Need to cut the key way and make a mandrel to turn the blank between centres.

Other replacements coming along.