Will notches in a tapered seating surface affect performance too much

[TorontoBuilder]

I want to make a D1-3 to stronghold chuck adapter since Oneway only makes adapters for screw mount spindles.

I'm not interested in a debate (too much anyways) on the advisability of turning wood on a metal lathe, I more wish to know if this may be unsafe or lacking good alignment.

The stronghold chucks mount on a 1" long spigot with a 3+ degree taper. The chuck is secured by two opposing M5 screws from the rear of the adapter. These two holes are slightly over sized and unthreaded.

Two M5 threaded holes offset 90 degrees allow screws to be inserted to push the chuck off the spigot for removal.

Sadly, all four holes land right in the D1-3 spindle taper surface. Two of the holes are larger to accommodate the socket screw head. I can use grub screws in the threaded holes to push off the stronghold chuck and therefore have a smaller notch in my tapered seating surface. Still there will be 4 evenly spaced notches in my tapered surface.

Any foreseeable issues that make this a non-starter?

I'll only be using this on the chippie so I cant throw any wide heavy bowls due to the small lathe size. I more want to turn tool handles, small round boxes, and small bowls and decorative wood items

 

[whydontu]

Completely uneducated response. I doubt the notches will have any effect on anything. As long as they are deburred with no projecting bits, so it doesn't scar the lathe spindle nose. Even then, highly unlikely since the nose is probably hardened and your adapter will be soft(er). There's no way you could put enough radial load on a wooden workpieces to deflect the adapter or overload the spindle taper.

 

[TorontoBuilder]

Completely uneducated response. I doubt the notches will have any effect on anything. As long as they are deburred with no projecting bits, so it doesn't scar the lathe spindle nose. Even then, highly unlikely since the nose is probably hardened and your adapter will be soft(er). There's no way you could put enough radial load on a wooden workpieces to deflect the adapter or overload the spindle taper.

Thank you for the reply, and cogent reasoning. I trust your judgement enough to try it.

Yes, I would be sure to eliminate any burrs, and the chuck will me unhardened since I cant see that being necessary.

 

[PeterT]

That's a hefty chunk of iron with a lot of precision surfaces. A standard D1-3 chuck adapter would save some finicky machining work adapting to the metal lathe side (big lump of iron + spindle nose taper + studs + retention screws). That would leave how to encompass the Stronghold spigot, but I would think if you bolted an oversize blank & turned it in-situ, it would be the best approach. You could even make an oops & just bolt on another - much smaller piece of steel.

Maybe another option is just turn a Stronghold matching spigot with a plain cylindrical end (or hex sided if you are worried about torque) so you can hold that side in your 3J (metal) chuck?
<edit> oh I think I see your issue - the bolts are rear to front mounted? <edit-2 so the shank would have to be reduced if feasible>

Not sure if this is the system but maybe another option is buy some soft jaws for your metalworking chuck & drill them to match the bolt pattern of the Stronghold?
(ie turf the Stronghold chuck part & just use their jaws)

 

[TorontoBuilder]

That's a hefty chunk of iron with a lot of precision surfaces. A standard D1-3 chuck adapter would save some finicky machining work adapting to the metal lathe side (big lump of iron + spindle nose taper + studs + retention screws). That would leave how to encompass the Stronghold spigot, but I would think if you bolted an oversize blank & turned it in-situ, it would be the best approach. You could even make an oops & just bolt on another - much smaller piece of steel.

View attachment 53144

Maybe another option is just turn a Stronghold matching spigot with a plain cylindrical end (or hex sided if you are worried about torque) so you can hold that side in your 3J (metal) chuck?
<edit> oh I think I see your issue - the bolts are rear to front mounted?
View attachment 53146

Not sure if this is the system but maybe another option is buy some soft jaws for your metalworking chuck & drill them to match the bolt pattern of the Stronghold?
(ie turf the Stronghold chuck part & just use their jaws)
View attachment 53145

This, this is why I post such things.

I got fixated on my design concept, and never thought of just making an adapter spigot that can clamp in a 3 jaw or better yet in a 5C 1 1/8" collect, since the 5C will be on my lathe most often.

I guess that was just too easy because I was thinking of the learning experience as well as the end product. I have plenty of other things I can learn on.

 

[Stuart Samuel]

I want to make a D1-3 to stronghold chuck adapter since Oneway only makes adapters for screw mount spindles.

I'm not interested in a debate (too much anyways) on the advisability of turning wood on a metal lathe, I more wish to know if this may be unsafe or lacking good alignment.

The stronghold chucks mount on a 1" long spigot with a 3+ degree taper. The chuck is secured by two opposing M5 screws from the rear of the adapter. These two holes are slightly over sized and unthreaded.

Two M5 threaded holes offset 90 degrees allow screws to be inserted to push the chuck off the spigot for removal.

View attachment 53133


Sadly, all four holes land right in the D1-3 spindle taper surface. Two of the holes are larger to accommodate the socket screw head. I can use grub screws in the threaded holes to push off the stronghold chuck and therefore have a smaller notch in my tapered seating surface. Still there will be 4 evenly spaced notches in my tapered surface.

View attachment 53134

Any foreseeable issues that make this a non-starter?

I'll only be using this on the chippie so I cant throw any wide heavy bowls due to the small lathe size. I more want to turn tool handles, small round boxes, and small bowls and decorative wood items

On the advisability of turning wood on a metal lathe, I do it semi-regularly. So if it’s a terrible sin, you’ve got company.

I end up making or modifying spinning chucks to suit dimensioned drawings, and I find it a really convenient way to hit my marks, and then just blend/interpolate between.

 

[Susquatch]

On the advisability of turning wood on a metal lathe, I do it semi-regularly. So if it’s a terrible sin, you’ve got company.

There's no way you could put enough radial load on a wooden workpieces to deflect the adapter or overload the spindle taper.

I'm not interested in a debate (too much anyways) on the advisability of turning wood on a metal lathe, I more wish to know if this may be unsafe or lacking good alignment.

I wouldn't be interested in a debate either. I've done it for 50 years and I'm not about to stop regardless of other opinions.

I routinely use my metal lathe to turn wood. And not just intentional wood projects. I often make steel prototypes out of wood first. Costs less than steel and I don't have a 3D printer. Wood chips vacuum up real easy. If there is a downside, I've never heard it and I wouldn't care.

 

[mbond]

You can count me in on using 'metal' tools for wood too. The reverse is much harder, but carbide and HSS can cut softwood and hardwood quite well. The motion of a machine tool bit through the work is less organic then a hand controlled chisel, but it is equally possible to use those tools with a modified tool post

I have a very small space, so I have no choice. But I wouldn't hesitate no mater what. The biggest risk seems to be that sawdust absorbs more oil than other kinds of chips and the ways need to be oiled more.

 

[TorontoBuilder]

You can count me in on using 'metal' tools for wood too. The reverse is much harder, but carbide and HSS can cut softwood and hardwood quite well. The motion of a machine tool bit through the work is less organic then a hand controlled chisel, but it is equally possible to use those tools with a modified tool post

I have a very small space, so I have no choice. But I wouldn't hesitate no mater what. The biggest risk seems to be that sawdust absorbs more oil than other kinds of chips and the ways need to be oiled more.

I seem to recall that you too are in Toronto? Or am I misremembering?

It is hard to afford any space in Toronto so not surprising. I'm trying to make my shop work for wood and metal as much as possible. Then I have brother's for fall back with greater capacity. If you ever need to use equipment you dont have access to ask if we have it. If we do you're welcome to come use it or borrow it if transportable

 

[Megar arc 5040dd]

When you turn wood on a metal lathe how is the clean up? I am picturing the saw dust absorbing the oil and becoming an oil soaked mess that sticks to everything and isn't easy to vacuum up? or do you wipe down the machine and use it dry? I seem to recall the Atlas lathe book mentioning that the highest speeds were for turning wood.

 

[TorontoBuilder]

When you turn wood on a metal lathe how is the clean up? I am picturing the saw dust absorbing the oil and becoming an oil soaked mess that sticks to everything and isn't easy to vacuum up? or do you wipe down the machine and use it dry? I seem to recall the Atlas lathe book mentioning that the highest speeds were for turning wood.

Before I sold my wood lathe I used a dust collector to suck in the shavings. Mostly the material is fine long shavings rather than dust and sucks up well.

Sanding however is fine dust, which sucks up decently as well. I figure way covers will protect from dust sticking to the ways, and from getting into the lower parts of the lathe. I'll have to see in practice how well it goes.

 

[mbond]

I seem to recall that you too are in Toronto? Or am I misremembering?

It is hard to afford any space in Toronto so not surprising. I'm trying to make my shop work for wood and metal as much as possible. Then I have brother's for fall back with greater capacity. If you ever need to use equipment you dont have access to ask if we have it. If we do you're welcome to come use it or borrow it if transportable

Yes, I live in the west end of Toronto. About 10 minutes straight north of the last meet up spot in Etobicoke.

I have a full time job in finance, and do much less in the shop than I would like, but if it comes up I'll take you up on that! And vise versa - if I've got it, anyone is welcome!

 

[Susquatch]

When you turn wood on a metal lathe how is the clean up?

Easy peasy. I don't use flood or mist. Just drip. The sawdust or shavings just dry up what little drip oil there is. Easy to vacuum up in the regular shop vac.

 

[mbond]

In my experience, it is the finest particles that are the most difficult to deal with. And it is those exact ones that the introduction of a fluid will help the most with. Oil is an effective coagulant for cellulose, so it actually makes it easier to clean up. The biggest concern is ruining the piece by contamination

 

[Susquatch]

In my experience, it is the finest particles that are the most difficult to deal with.

We live at opposite extremes!

No idea why. Might have something to do with old eyes that only see the big stuff..... Course I didn't have a problem with fine stuff when I was 50 years younger either.

 

[mbond]

For me, the fine stuff becomes airborne and gets into stuff. The big stuff just falls on the bed / floor

 

[Susquatch]

For me, the fine stuff becomes airborne and gets into stuff. The big stuff just falls on the bed / floor

I think we need a definition for fine and big. For me, fine is powder, tiny sand sized chips, or steel wool. Med is little chips or ball point spring wires. Big is a wide range but basically big chips and big curls. I've never had airborne chips unless you meant flying chips. All sizes fly sometimes.

 

[mbond]

For wood, when I say fine I mean powder. Significantly smaller than a grain of sand. Because wood is light, particles of this size can easily float in the air. All metals are more dense, and particles of the same size don't.

 

[TorontoBuilder]

For me, the fine stuff becomes airborne and gets into stuff. The big stuff just falls on the bed / floor

the stuff being lungs.

most woodworkers take ridiculous risks considering that fine dust lingers for hours. Ever wonder why commercial shops have to have their dust collectors outside of the building envelop?

 

[Susquatch]

For wood, when I say fine I mean powder. Significantly smaller than a grain of sand. Because wood is light, particles of this size can easily float in the air. All metals are more dense, and particles of the same size don't.

Sorry, I thought we were talking metal. Silly me. Now I know what you meant by airborne.

Wood is a whole different matter. No arguments from me.

For big jobs on wood, I usually open the barn doors, use a mask, and run a big HUGE 4FT DIAM fan at the barn door - even in the winter. I try not to work on wood in winter.

But I confess I've been known to make a few fast simple cuts on the table saw, skill saw, or lathe with no fan at all.