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Other Safeties Use them or Not?

F

Former Member

Guest
I am very safety aware and will always suggest to err on the side of caution, why I work alone and an injury could have serious consequences.

HOWEVER....

There are certain safeties on machines that I find are hinderances since I learned everything on old machines without them. The most recent is the guard over the lathe chuck. Initially I tried to accept it but it is a hazard under certain operations and reduces useable space.

So its gone.

How many others do the same thing (not just with lathes but all machines and why)?
 
Generally safeties are the first to go for me. With in reason.
Grinder safeties stay..... Lathe chuck safety INSTANTLY gone.
Bigger issues is loose clothing and or long hair, I seen accidents with both, The hair one was scary. nearly tore his scalp off.
Rings are said to be unsafe, I wear mine always, but it has saved my fingies 2x ( piping bolt up )

YMMW

Gluck
 
It's better to work with the safety features than to rip them off and remember not to do what they were trying to prevent you from doing.
However, I totally understand the inconvenience many of these things can be and I am not nearly safety conscious enough myself.
 
Neither of my lathes have chuck covers. So I don't need to worry about how wise it is to remove them. My mills and drill press don't have covers either. Same deal as the lathe.

What a horrible discussion to have. Yet also excellent. I probably wouldn't remove mine if they had come with it.

A short story. I did my Executive MBA at Ivey School of business in London. The program was only offered to industry sponsored individuals. One of the characters in my class was the City Engineer in Seoul Korea. This was back when most industry in the East was just copies of technology use elsewhere. He told the class that they bought all their machines from other parts of the world. The first thing they did to them was to remove ALL the safety equipment. Imagine removing the two hand paddles from a big punch..... Basically, they didn't care about injuries. If someone hurt themselves, there was another guy in line anxious to have their job.

When I was in China 10 years ago on a consulting job, I saw the same thing. No safety equipment on anything!
 
I see the need of some safety devices, but I also see the draw back as we become accustom to them to the point of relying on them, it has a safety so its ok. Our risk acceptance become skewed as we expect protection.

Are we breeding a less safe worker with too much reliance on someone thinking about our well being.

But back to your applications and views as it is enlightening and educational.
 
Susquatch said:
Neither of my lathes have chuck covers. So I don't need to worry about how wise it is to remove them. My mills and drill press don't have covers either. Same deal as the lathe.

What a horrible discussion to have. Yet also excellent. I probably wouldn't remove mine if they had come with it.

A short story. I did my Executive MBA at Ivey School of business in London. The program was only offered to industry sponsored individuals. One of the characters in my class was the City Engineer in Seoul Korea. This was back when most industry in the East was just copies of technology use elsewhere. He told the class that they bought all their machines from other parts of the world. The first thing they did to them was to remove ALL the safety equipment. Imagine removing the two hand paddles from a big punch..... Basically, they didn't care about injuries. If someone hurt themselves, there was another guy in line anxious to have their job.

When I was in China 10 years ago on a consulting job, I saw the same thing. No safety equipment on anything!
Click to expand...
I was moving a big machine awhile ago, the foreman was lamenting they had to get rid of it. He said if they knew what was coming, they would’ve bought spares of the same machine they were sending to scrap, years ago. He said all the extra guards and safety cages on new equipment make it physically difficult to even get material INTO the press. Let alone have a decent production rate. Removing any of the safety features opened up a huge liability issue for them, so they had to leave them on.
 
Safeties have their place when they are properly designed for the machine and still allow the operator to run the machine “safely”. My lathes do not have chuck covers and part if me thinks that if they did and I got wrapped up in it, the chuck cover might hurt me worse - or prevent pulling away to avoid injury. A large shield for coolant, different animal, but I would think safer than the chuck cover. We had that at work and it was a pain for many operations. Milling machine- I like the mag base plexiglass coolant shield. You can position it and it prevents crap flying at you.

Grinders - hmmmmm. With wire wheels- yes but other than that …. Face shield and gloves. For the most part any injury I have is from grinding myself (LOL) - face shield for possible wheel disintegration.

Never used a table saw guard but do use guides, feather boards, push blocks etc and try to shield any blow back - and never stand in direct path of the blade. Same with shaper and other wood tools.

Safety never sleeps though and you always should check with a dry run and act accordingly.

If you cannot “safely” put the blank into the machine, your safety devices are inadequate and poorly designed.
 
wearing gloves. If you are close enough to a spinning thing to get your glove caught, it "ain't the gloves fault" Even when filing or using emery on the lathe. I've seen machinists using a 1"square of emery to polish something, but not me.

When I worked in rope rescue, our group had to make an OSHA submission s to why we weren't using dorsal attachments. Almost all rope access stuff is riddled with dangerous and stupid requirements that actually seriously increase a worker's risk.
 
Marginally off topic, but that seems to be a thing lately:)
Being brand new to owning a lathe, I am already nervous about the forward/reverse switch.
It seems like it would be easy to bump when making speed changes on the pulley system.
I try to remember to disengage the belt tensioner which should make it a bit safer if I hit the on switch but would still hurt if I did.
Would it be time and money well spent to switch to a on / off button switch with a BIG RED STOP switch?
Or would it be better to just reconfigure myself to always unplug the lathe before making speed changes?
FWIW I re-watched Blondihacks lathe series and am now making shiny smooth practice cuts as I slowly run out of turnable materials.
 
Doggggboy said:
Marginally off topic, but that seems to be a thing lately:)
Being brand new to owning a lathe, I am already nervous about the forward/reverse switch.
It seems like it would be easy to bump when making speed changes on the pulley system.
I try to remember to disengage the belt tensioner which should make it a bit safer if I hit the on switch but would still hurt if I did.
Would it be time and money well spent to switch to a on / off button switch with a BIG RED STOP switch?
Or would it be better to just reconfigure myself to always unplug the lathe before making speed changes?
FWIW I re-watched Blondihacks lathe series and am now making shiny smooth practice cuts as I slowly run out of turnable materials.
Click to expand...
There is only one correct answer, do what is required to make it safe.

Unfortunately the thread is about what we do and why (it may be safer even though is not the correct practice) but not recommend.
 
Doggggboy said:
Would it be time and money well spent to switch to a on / off button switch with a BIG RED STOP switch?
Click to expand...

Let me answer your question this way.

My red e-stop button is on the lathe headstock to the far left of where I stand when I am working. If anything goes squirrelly, I'm gunna have to reach through the action plane to hit it. I don't like that. I want my e-stop on the right where I can reach it without taking bigger risks.

I have already purchased the new e-stop. I plan to wire it in parallel with my current e-stop so I can hit either one. Ideally, I'd like them to both require arming as well. A nice reminder of the need to check lots of things before cutting a part.
 
Susquatch said:
Let me answer your question this way.

My red e-stop button is on the lathe headstock to the far left of where I stand when I am working. If anything goes squirrelly, I'm gunna have to reach through the action plane to hit it. I don't like that. I want my e-stop on the right where I can reach it without taking bigger risks.

I have already purchased the new e-stop. I plan to wire it in parallel with my current e-stop so I can hit either one. Ideally, I'd like them to both require arming as well. A nice reminder of the need to check lots of things before cutting a part.
Click to expand...
Great info.
Thanks.
 
Susquatch said:
I have already purchased the new e-stop. I plan to wire it in parallel with my current e-stop so I can hit either one. Ideally, I'd like them to both require arming as well. A nice reminder of the need to check lots of things before cutting a part.
Click to expand...
"In parallel" might not be the way to do this. I am sure you will trace out the wiring or check the schematic but, in some installations, this might be akin to put a normally closed switch in parallel with another normally closed switch. Ain't gonna work.

Just a heads up before you go. If that switch truly is impractical, maybe just move the switch? A foot bar with a switch is a nice universal addition, imho.

Mine has that but it is tied to a brake too. Sadly, I have used it more than once.....I hate parting off! :mad:
 
ShawnR said:
"In parallel" might not be the way to do this. I am sure you will trace out the wiring or check the schematic but, in some installations, this might be akin to put a normally closed switch in parallel with another normally closed switch. Ain't gonna work.

Just a heads up before you go. If that switch truly is impractical, maybe just move the switch? A foot bar with a switch is a nice universal addition, imho.

Mine has that but it is tied to a brake too. Sadly, I have used it more than once.....I hate parting off! :mad:
Click to expand...
The FWD/REV switch is on the change gear cover on the left hand side.
Right beside the lift cover for the belt change system.
Thinking about it I could just open the change gear cover to move the switch farther away while doing the belt change.
 
ShawnR said:
"In parallel" might not be the way to do this. I am sure you will trace out the wiring or check the schematic but, in some installations, this might be akin to put a normally closed switch in parallel with another normally closed switch. Ain't gonna work.

Just a heads up before you go. If that switch truly is impractical, maybe just move the switch? A foot bar with a switch is a nice universal addition, imho.

Mine has that but it is tied to a brake too. Sadly, I have used it more than once.....I hate parting off! :mad:
Click to expand...

Yes, I have considered that possibility. I don't truthfully know exactly what's there yet. Either way, I plan to do a major re-wire when I find and install the 3phase motor and vfd. The details of how the switches are wired will fall out and get handled during that process. My thoughts are to use an internal relay controlled by the two switches. Ya, I know that's not really a parallel wired system, but the result is. The reason for that is that I want to run resistive braking too since my lathe has no foot brake. Lots and lots to figure out when that project hits the drawing board. First I need to find an affordable 2.5 or 3Hp vfd rated motor.

And ya, parting is not my favorite task either. Unlike many on here, I love threading though!
 
To add interupts to a normally closed circuit, they would go in series. Any switch will break the loop.

In a normally open circuit, then they can be put in parallel as any one will close the loop.
 
ShawnR said:
To add interupts to a normally closed circuit, they would go in series. Any switch will break the loop.

In a normally open circuit, then they can be put in parallel as any one will close the loop.
Click to expand...

Sounds a bit like an alarm wiring system..... LOL!
 
Doggggboy said:
The FWD/REV switch is on the change gear cover on the left hand side.
Right beside the lift cover for the belt change system.
Thinking about it I could just open the change gear cover to move the switch farther away while doing the belt change.
Click to expand...

Have you tried running the machine with the change gear cover open? It may already have a lockout switch for when the cover is open.
 
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