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My first mill....help!

S

Sphen

New Member
Hey guys, I've finally decided to take the plunge and try and pick up some of the basics of home hobby milling. I'm not under any disillusion, although I'm generally handy and learn fast I'm not expecting anything great. However, the basics of milling would be a handy skill to have in the tool bag. I already have a couple small jig projects I'd like to start with, nothing overly challenging and nothing pressing. Looking back at the projects I wish I'd been able to do over the past few years I'd be spending most of my time with aluminum and wood.

Now I'm still in research mode so while I read through forums, watch videos and read books I'm starting my hunt for a used table top mill. I know it would be better to start with something old, big and heavy but unfortunately I'm restricted in space and am limited to a bench top mill. I have a decent size garage but between my wife parking in it in the winter, all the kids crap and the many woodworking tools, there isn't much room left. I also know a lathe will be on the recommendation list but it's a little lower of a priority for me. I don't have any immediately lathe needs but I do have access to one down the road on occasion.

So I was wondering if anyone here could recommend an entry level mill under the $2000 mark. I've seen the following recommended on various forums and discussion, any feedback?

- Craftex cx601
- King pdm-30
- Grizzly G0758

Any other recommendations? Thanks guys!
 
A couple of guys here have the 601's...I'll let them speak to how they like them.

More weight is better; the Grizzly only comes in at 200+ lbs. I have used one of the King-type machines. A lot of guys dislike the fact that the column is round and can drift under load (as opposed to dovetail columns). That makes sense. I think there are YouTube vids on this exact topic.

There...you've tapped out my milling expertise already as I only have a mini mill. But others will know more and chime in I'm sure.
 
If you are willing to try to get by with a benchtop milling machine, you might consider a lathe/mill combo:

$_59.JPG


https://www.kijiji.ca/v-power-tool/...ftex-lathe-mill-combo-with-tooling/1477887369

Seller is asking $1,800. Assuming nothing is broken, that strikes me as being in the ball park.

As long as you are mostly working aluminum and are patient, you can get a taste for machining with a little combo like that. Heavy cuts in steel won't go well. Only you know if you have the temperament to deal with the machine's limitations.

If you decide to upgrade, you could likely sell it for roughly what you paid for it!

Craig
 
I've been dreaming about a milling machine also for years and haven't been able to make the plunge yet. I think the general recommendations for buying a milling machine is quite like buying a lathe. Get as big as you can and then some and then spend a lot of money on tooling and accessories to be able to really do stuff.
Having said that, I do believe it is better to just get whatever works in your own particular constraints (size/money) and work with the darn thing. You will almost always want bigger and better no matter what you get, but at least if you have something you will be doing something. I'm still waiting to live that advice myself in regards to a milling machine, but with a lathe I am doing just that. I bought a small Asian lathe that I had room for and could afford and am doing stuff and love it. Yes of course it has many shortfalls, but I'd still not have a lathe if I was holding out for a bigger better and saving money for that. Once your constraints are truly defined, the decisions are easier.
 
trlvn said:
If you are willing to try to get by with a benchtop milling machine, you might consider a lathe/mill combo:

$_59.JPG


https://www.kijiji.ca/v-power-tool/...ftex-lathe-mill-combo-with-tooling/1477887369

Seller is asking $1,800. Assuming nothing is broken, that strikes me as being in the ball park.

As long as you are mostly working aluminum and are patient, you can get a taste for machining with a little combo like that. Heavy cuts in steel won't go well. Only you know if you have the temperament to deal with the machine's limitations.

If you decide to upgrade, you could likely sell it for roughly what you paid for it!

Craig
Click to expand...
There you go! A perfect combo unit that fits your budget and gives you extra machining capabilities. As Craig pointed out, you probably could recoup most of the purchase price if you changed your mind about it down the road.
 
If I may, and this is entirely my own opinion on a combo machine...if your entire work forecast is for plastic, wood or aluminum then it might be a very good tool for you...however...

I owned a similar machine (a house of tools offering in mid 90's) for a very short time when I first entered into the hobby machining field...initial cost was a very attractive point to me, but I soon learned that the frustration of trying to cut anything harder than aluminum soon outweighed the attractiveness of cost.

The thing that soon becomes very obvious when you try to cut steel is the flexibility/lack of sturdiness of the bed of the machine that is magnified by the distance between the bed & the spindle c/l.. If you look at the supplied photo you will see the height of the tailstock & tool holder from the bed is quite tall...this distance enables a much easier opportunity for "twist" between the cutting tool & bed structure when cutting even mild steel.

I should add that all of us have a different "frustration threshold", and I'm, for the most part not easily frustrated when frugality enters the equation, but that machine got the best of me in very short order.
 
For instance I mentioned in 'member spotted deals' a few months back about a full sized Bridgeport for $1500. The motor would need replacing (it is 440V 3ph) and needs some cleaning but it was sound. Deals can be had on used more sturdy equipment. The trick is making room for it.
 
Your choices are all good for entry level for price specified... but as others pointed out you may look at used market carefully to find something better and more sturdy. $2000 should get you rather sturdy old horizontal mill including all fees. Easily on auction. That horizontal should have vertical head as well. As long as you have space for it and no fear of moving or paying someone to move 3500lbs / 4000lbs machine that would be far better machine to have (as long as not totally trashed) as opposed to anything new you suggested.

That machine would be able to handle all work hobbyist throws at it. Don't worry about 3ph at all - you can either go VFD or Rotary converter.
 
go find one to use. not sure what city you are in? you could join the local maker space if they have a mill and do some work with it. you will soon find out what you are actually interested in owning.
 
Dabbler said:
Sphen If you are in Calgary, I can help move a machine for you.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the offer...unfortunately it would be a hike indeed, I'm located in the Toronto/Barrie area.

I dropped in at my local busy bee yesterday in order to get a look at a few options in person. Looking at the sizes, the 601 is probably the best fit in my garage, basically the biggest I can fit. I do like the larger floor model, the 603, but it's too big. As long as this is a hobby it looks like I'm pretty much stuck with a bench top model. There are just too many other higher priorities claiming my space; primarily all my wood tools and the vast quantities of crap that comes with having a bunch of kids.

My house is over 140 years old, a historic Victorian home that is board and batten and and is covered in ginger-breading and custom wood working, both inside and out. The previous owner was not the greatest at maintaining it and so much of the inside and out are coming due for significant replacement and repair. With only a two car garage the bandsaw, jointer, planner, dust collector, mitre saw, drill press and table saw all get used regularly and take up a lot of room. Added to that is that I'm due for a lathe real soon as I have a lot of spindle work in the near future, all this means that as long as metalworking is a hobby, the mill will have to stay relatively small and play second fiddle to the woodworking equipment.

Your feedback guys has been great, I really appreciate it.
 
Hey Sphen,

i am just North of Barrie. Shoot me a reminder in the new year and you can pop by for a look at my shop. It is possible to work some metal and wood
 
-- I used to live on the Oakville/Burlington border - Burloak Drive!

Good luick on your search.

There are a LOT of good used lathes in your area. Consider 'second operation lathes - yes they are on their own stand, but many of them have 20-28" beds, and are about 3 1/2 - 4 feet wide - the same as a 7X28 plus or minus a few inches, depending on the actual lathe.
 
Pro's and Con's to everything and you have to figure out what is important to you.

You have a choice between round column and square column mills.
Square columns that you have picked loses torque as you reduce your speeds.
Round columns are typically belt drive and gain torque as you reduce the speeds.

Square column selected is smaller, lighter then the round column selected.
The round column out of the selection would be better at heavier work.

Flip sides,
The round column loses its spot if you change "z" height. This is a pain in the ass and everyone that owns one hates that. There are ways to re zero but its more work. Sometimes there is no way around it if you are running R8 with a massive jacobs chuck..... you almost have to operate at max quill travel which is less then ideal.
The square column can tilt its head side to side.... the round column cannot. If you see my thread on gunsmithing you can see where this screwed me over.

light weight do everything machine. Square column.
Heavier machine that is a bit more rigid and wont stall out at low speeds. Round column.

Oh, Maybe I should put a disclaimer at the top..... I am not a professional machinist. I learn from the awesome people here and some professionals that I am friends with. I could be wrong on some details but this is what I learned when I was researching it all.

Hope that helps a bit. Or at least add to the confusion ;)
 
Just try to buy a bit bigger then the mini mill - for a little bit more $$$ you can get a sturdier desktop machine. If going mini see whatever you can get rid of the side to side swivel - that "feature" alone erases half of the rigidity of the little machine. Buying old iron in desktop size will be difficult - you are limited to mostly newer machines. Buying desktop sized old iron lathe on the other side should be easy or much easier - through figuring out value could be difficult for a novice.
 
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