import QCTP BXA holders - wanting to know personal experience

[Jimbojones]

I'm in the market to buy some more BXA holders from US suppliers. Figuring that the 202/202XL style will be the most versatile and checked the following vendors:

- Accusize: bought 1 and it seemed okay but have seen/heard of tool-side dimension issues. They are also very long/narrow and have small(er) dia. set screws that are a bit soft. 202 size only
- Shars (new): almost identical to above except they also have 202XL format (3/4" vs 5/8" holding). Old Shars looked more like the ones below but are now unavailable. Dovetail appears to be .004" wider than Accusize so am wondering if thats going to make a snugness issue (Shars sales rep admitted they had complaints so they publish full dimensions as a precaution)
- CDCO: shorter but thicker (more like Aloris dimensions) they look cruddy but probably the cheapest and have seen decent reviews re: trueness. thicker set screws Guy is a jerk to deal with
- Phase II: I own these and they work well; roughly same size and nicer finish than CDCO but notably more expensive. Also, set screw OD thread is metric wherease ID tool size is SAE....wth?!?!

Aloris/Dorian: not in my price range

I've never actually tried the new Shars or CDCO...looking for opinions from anyone that has. Also, are there other import brands in the sub-$20 range (Grizzly is overpriced and same thing can be gotten elsewhere)

 

[DPittman]

I bought several items from CDCO Tool and won't ever again. Most of the items were OK but bought a AXA tool post and tool holders that ranged from just passable, to unusable tool holder. I know a lot of the cheap Asian tooling is hit and miss, but when I tried to contact CDCO about the issue, he would not respond. I've read other reports of similar experiences with CDCO Tool by others.

Don

 

[PeterT]

I haven't bought those from Accusize but I'm going to guess its the same Chinese stuff you see under a variety of names. Seems as of late Accusize is selling through ebay & Amazon. So just check the shipping cost, they don't do you any favors. Generically the quality seems to vary with these toolposts, either by vintage or re-seller or..? Plan on buying a tap to clean out the schmeg filled screw holes & replace the cheesy set screws with good ones. After that they work perfectly fine, at least for my purposes.

I'm not sure if this Shars sketch is dimension reference you are going off but.... 0.004" to a fillet or chamfered edge is a bizarre way to convey information! (Read I don't think I would trust that, it may be just to convey nominal size).

Shars looks like the ones I got from KBC a while back. Good price but $FX & how you land them might gobble up the savings. They don't even attempt to rebrand anymore, proudly says made in China.
http://www.shars.com/turning-and-facing-holder-1-type-201-xl

I purchased mine from KBC in the past because if you buy a few the weight adds up & I like $8.95 to my door delivered within days. They claim to be interchangeable with Aloris/Dorian which I have heard people claim is true. I have the matching Chinese tool post (piston style) but what I'm saying is dimensionally they seem to be pretty good & consistent. I had to tune up one but it was not the dovetail surface. it was incomplete chamfering on the edge. At least with KBC you stand a chance of exchange/return & reasonable return shipping cost. That might be more problematic with some of the other vendors.

 

[John Conroy]

I bought some from Accusize on ebay. They were absolute junk and I returned them. I then ordered some from Matt at Precision Matthews and even though they are made in China they are ok. As Peter says the set screw were cheesy so I replaced them.

 

[Janger]

Make some!

 

[PeterT]

Maybe some of those 4140 logs will evolve into some interesting tool holders & accessories, haha. Some custom jobbies would be worth making like when you have odd shank tooling - parting tools, knurlers, boring bars. That's one of the issues with these typical kits, the open tool shank gap is kind of progressive sizing. 200-series is 0.625", 300 is 0.75"? etc. I've seen some adaptations where people have made their own to hold slightly larger tooling or holding different kinds of tools. Although you cant too weird with the dimensions before it doesn't fit the toolpost or lathe centering geometry. OTOH, my 20$ specials have nicely ground dovetails & they were within a 0.0005" parallel. There's a few hours machining in there.

John, sounds like you are batting low averages with Accu. Was it you or maybe someone else that had similar issue with collets or something being poop TIR despite all the 0.0000 'specs'? I've been lucky so far on the few things so I'm probably due. I bought a thin parallel set & cheapo mini gage block set that were better than what looked identical set at Travers (which I returned). The mini vises are hardened tool steel & ground quite accurate, but I did rebuild the screw assembly with my own version. That's what makes buying this stuff such a crap shoot sometimes. They look generically the same, likely originate from same country, but results can vary & not necessarily indicated by price.

 

[John Conroy]

I have bought from Accusize on 6 occasions and had to return the items 3 times. They pay the freight both ways when you buy on eBay so there's no cost to me except wasted time. I have pretty much given up on them. The only thing I've bought from them that was decent quality was some roughing end mills.

 

[Janger]

I think accusize is generally better than BB but not high quality. Not so bad on the wallet. I've bought a number of things QCTP, mills, cutters. For me it suffices.

 

[Johnwa]

I've had a Chinese axa(I think) for a few years. I've been able to buy matching toolholders at busybee. I finally got tired of the set screws and replaced them with square top ones.

 

[Dabbler]

My Busy Bee AXA is working just fine. Bought 4 additional holders, all of which have been satisfactory.

 

[PeterT]

Cant recall where I found this pic. I had a more complicated scratch built idea of this concept, but as you can see he basically modified a stock one. Might be a better way to snug up & secure the bearings into position against the part than the cross bolt, but anyway, interesting idea that maybe mitigates installing the travelling steady for skinny fiddly bits.

 

[Jimbojones]

I'm only buying holders since I already have a decent post e.g. wedge Phase II.

I've decided to grab some (but less quantity than I originally planned) CDCO ones since spec vs pricewise they seem to be the most favourable. Seller readily admits his products 'are from China' <in a derogatory tone> and I don't expect any service from him and as long as he doesn't mess up the order. Funny enough..he too sounds like he's from China so I guess all expectations should be lowered as per his own comments

I'm also picking up some Shars since they should be no worse than the Accusize and I prefer the XL format (never want to throw away a garage-sale tool just because it has a 3/4" shank). Would have bought all-Shars but I'm not sure I like the longer/skinnier layout and if there are fitment problems, at least I wont have many to modify.

Overall, I'm expecting cruddy set-screws but 1) I wont be using them often 2) I can get better ones @ work.

FWIW - I took my Accusize BXA M8's and tapped the holder out to M10 set screws to be beefier like other brands....holy heck that metal is hard! lube and low speed and it still manage to dull both a HSS and cobalt bit. I'm not going to bother heat treating to make the process easier...just never figured it would be that much effort to drill. Mention this because I had also consider enlarging the 5/8" tool slot to 3/4" but after that...no thanks, I'll buy a few XL holders.

 

[IHmachinery]

I have about 15-20 of the Accusize toolholders in this size, and I have been very happy with them. The set screws are a bit low grade, but I haven't had any problems, and one could easily swap them out with better quality screws. I have milled a few to accept 3/4" shank tooling and this is where I noticed quite a difference in hardness. Some were pretty easy to mill with a carbide 4-flute endmill, whereas others were so hard as to almost defy milling. But for the price, I think they are great value, certainly for a hobby machinist like me.


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[Jimbojones]

For giggles, I got a special drill bit from a supplier to demo on that Accusize holder on hold-down hole #4 (left it un-enlarged since the other 3 holes destroyed 2 bits). I know some safe-crackers and they claimed these are the 'the thing' for hard metal/concrete. Company name is RELTON and most people know them for their 'Rapid Tap' lube. Got one of their GROO-V bits, slapped on some lube and low speed in the mill and went after hole #4....completely day/night as far as effort and speed of drilling. Went through it like it was mild steel and if I had tried a different holder, I would have assumed it was different metal hardness (as posted above re: Accusize variable hardness). Can't say I have been this impressed since I stopped using box store bits and went to name brands...and this is yet another tier above that. They are carbide tipped and typically used for concrete (this particular SKU comes w/straight shank) but I now believe that safe-crackers actually CAN drill through a hardened door, through concrete and in to a tumbler/lock assembly with the same bit. These don't come in a wide variety of diameters like regular bits so that's disappointing but I would say that they make an excellent pilot drill to get you close; I originally needed a 11/32" hole but the closest they had was a 5/16" so that's was I used and since it didn't work-harden the hole, I was able to use a lower-quality bit to enlarge to the 11/32" final size I needed. Rare that you find a product that actually exceeds expectations.