6 jaw chuck options?

[mjautek]

Hi all,

any thoughts on reasonable priced options for a 6 jaw chuck? I'm thinking maybe it's about time I get a chuck for my lathe (holbrook minor) that doesn't look like it was fished out of a dumpster.

right now I'm looking at aliexpress ones which seem to go from 200$ ish (125mm with one set of jaws) to 300$ ish (160mm ish with 2 sets of jaws) and I'd slap it on a D1-4 back plate from accusize or something ? or are there other options that I should consider that don't cost as much as I paid for my lathe?

cheers.

 

[Susquatch]

I'll be following your travels on this one. I'd like one too, but haven't been able to make it make sense yet. A cheap 6 jaw prolly isn't any better than a good 3 jaw. So I can't really make sense of getting one on Ali. Too expensive everywhere else.

 

[Susquatch]

Btw, if you don't have a good collet chuck yet, I'd be putting that a few miles in front of a 6jaw. I have a Bison 5C chuck and it is my hands down favorite. Lives on my lathe more than all my other chucks combined.

 

[DavidR8]

@mjautek do you do a lot of work on thin walled stock?

 

[jorogi]

Here's one option, just make one.

 

[PeterT]

6J can be very spendy in the established lines, Bison, PBA, Buck. Gator is Chinese mid-level name supposedly modeled after Bison but harder to find in Canada. Some people have had good luck with Shars. When it comes to the Ali models, my guess is 'depends'. Some of it is crap & others are acceptable (depending on what that word means to you). Its impossible to judge by a picture so best you can do is read recent reviews & actual user experience & hope they aren't BS. I suspect you are looking at something like this? All I can tell you is I bought a relabeled (but I think same root brand) 3" 3J for a tooling setup. It had a brutally bad jaw grind & poor scroll quality. Maybe it was an unlucky Monday model or just that size although I've read similar reviews of larger chucks. I bought a different Asian flavor for a bit more money & I'm totally happy for what its intended. If you don't have the provisions to regrind the jaws & return policy is cost prohibitive, they make expensive boat anchors. Regarding collets, IMO it really depends on the predominant work. Collets are great but 5C range only goes to 1.0625" diameter & OD only. A decent set of ideally 1/64" increment collets needs to be added to price of collet chuck. 6J can grip larger diameters, OD or ID with reversible jaws. Check the minimum OD grip diameter of 6 because its larger tan many 3J of same nominal OD. There is work holding overlap between collets & chuck but IMO they are kind of different tools.

 

[Tom Kitta]

I got one for like 150 or so all in. Its OK. Did not come with 2nd set of jaws. Did not know there is one available - maybe a cool thing to get - do you have a link?

Chinese ones are nothing special - all of "ali" style ones look the same, it could be a luck thing, you may get one mid day Monday or end of day Friday one.

 

[Chipper5783]

I went with the buy once cry once option for my Smart and Brown (back in the day that lathe was an expensive piece of kit). Putting a POS chuck on it would cause bad karma - Bison 6J set tru, direct mount on the D1-4. It was most of $3K cad - the purchase pain has since subsided, so I’m now very happy with it.

Buying a cheapy chuck might work out fine, I didn’t try that first, so I cannot offer a comparison. I’ve bought plenty of cheapest possible tooling and for the most part it has worked fine. However, for primary components get a decent quality/reputation.

 

[Tom Kitta]

It sort of depends on what you want your 6j chuck for - for me it was mostly due not having one yet and maybe occasionally using it for a small pipe etc. Without extra set of jaws its range is touch bigger than collet chuck. For the most part it does same things a 3j is used for. I can see spending a lot more if its important part of the kit.

 

[Susquatch]

I was kind of interpreting your question as a kitting one. You sounded like you thought a 6 jaw would be nice to get next.

For the record, I wasn't suggesting a collet chuck will do what a 6 jaw will do. I was only saying that deciding between a 6 and collet chuck was a no brainer for me. I think you need to look at your needs and then decide which one you will get the most use of.

Rephrased. I assume you have a 3 jaw and a 4 jaw. What should you get next - a 6 jaw or a collet chuck? Given how much I use it, I'm sure glad I got the collet chuck first. YMMV

 

[Mcgyver]

Rephrased. I assume you have a 3 jaw and a 4 jaw. What should you get next - a 6 jaw or a collet chuck? Given how much I use it, I'm sure glad I got the collet chuck first. YMMV

yeah, like 1000:1.

Don't know your experience so apologies if I'm singing to the choir, but why a six jaw? If you know you need it, peace. However outside of thin walled material they don't do much good and potential, if the wrong three jaws end up doing the clamping, are sub-optimal . With a lathe of that quality I'd be saving my pennies to get a three jaw, new or used good shape of a quality make like Pratt Bernerd (not the atlas stuff), Rohm, Bison and so on. I would not be going to Aliexpress. Yeah I know new the cost of them, but you got a great price on the lathe because it didn't have tons of tooling. I'd watch for a clean looking quality used one.

 

[mjautek]

Thanks for the replies, everyone.

I (supposedly????) repair cameras so I think having a 6 jaw is justifiable. filter adapters, lens shades, lens tubes etc.. are all thin walled tubes. I have a pie chuck for one of my other lathes that I call into action sometimes for stuff like that.

I've got a mostly complete set of OEM collets for the holbrook (1/16-3/4") and a sjogren 5C chuck I am borrowing from work that I haven't tried out yet (whoops!), also I really should make a spindle nose adapter to use the 20mm deckel collets since I have a complete set of both imperial and metric which is pretty sweet... so on the collet front I'm doing alright I guess. One day I would like to rob a collet closer off of a hardinge but that is another thing...

other than that I have a 6" burnerd 3 jaw that I reground (poorly? it's not super good) with one set of jaws and a 8" 4 jaw that is basically too big for the machine but was supposedly the OEM option


I'm rather hesitant to spend real money (>500$) on a chuck for this lathe because it's pretty hammered and am often tempted to "upgrade" to something like a caz or big schaublin in better shape. it's a tough call- this thing is in pretty bad shape (0.001" runout on the SPINDLE NOSE!) but I guess unless a mint schaublin 135 falls in my lap, either way (repair or upgrade) it will be alot of work or money or both...


guess I'll keep an eye out on the used market then? but I'd be curious if anyone here has direct experience with the cheapo 6 jaws - my suspicion is that it's either OK or could be made to be OK but maybe I'm wrong. I've bought some shockingly good quality stuff from aliexpress (multifix AA clone) before so...

thanks!

 

[Tom Kitta]

Chucks I got in order:
3 jaw
4 jaw
ER40 collet chuck
large 4 jaw
large 3 jaw
5C collet chuck
6 jaw
Magnetic chuck
Face plate
4 jaw dependent chuck
I am sort of out of chuck types now to try. Maybe I go now with some quality stuff - as you can see collet chuck (home made) was just after 4 jaw. About half is import half is not.

 

[Susquatch]

Chucks I got in order:
3 jaw
4 jaw
ER40 collet chuck
large 4 jaw
large 3 jaw
5C collet chuck
6 jaw
Magnetic chuck
Face plate
4 jaw dependent chuck

Very interesting Tom. I like your priorities.

Mine went like this:
1, 2, 3. 3Jaw Scroll, 4 jaw independent & face plate all came with the lathe.
4. 4 lug spider chuck - home made.
5. Bison 5C Collet Chuck - my whole world changed that day.
6. 12 lug axial chuck - home made. Might bring this to our meetup.
7. 4 lug spider in a backplate close fit. - home made.

Every once in a while I think about an ER collet chuck. If I go that way, I'll make my own.

I also sometimes think about a set true 6 jaw scroll chuck. But I haven't really needed it yet so it may never happen. I won't even try to make my own.

@mjautek - if I needed to hold thin wall like you describe, I would make a home-made collet that is tightened by my 3 or 4 jaw that would subsequently close up to hold smaller parts like you describe. I'd prolly make them each a custom fit for whatever part I needed to hold. Even a very high quality 6 jaw could never equal a collet for work like that.

I frequently joke about how many custom collets I make. I call myself Susquatch the Collet Man or Collets-R-Us by the Hairy Guy...... LOL!

When I hit a process wall, my very first thought is almost always, "What kind of collet should I make to do that?"

 

[Mcgyver]

Have you looked at pot or step chucks? You can get them in 5C to some large sizes, that might be the way to go. Not sure if you can them stepped or just emergency, but you could turn the steps yourself. Its going to far better than the best 3 jaw or 6 jaw. Disadvantage is a short gripping distance.

If you're thinking Schaublin, you get the advantage of a drawbar style. There is a closing taper piece that screws on the spindle (bottom right of photo) and the step collet is closed via drawbar. I've got good selection in W12 and W20, just checked and my largest has a OD of 5.5", on a w20 collet! Hard to find and expensive, but that would be the most accurate imo, available as step or emergency.

 

[Susquatch]

Have you looked at pot or step chucks?

This is basically the same as the collets that I make to fit my 3 or 4 jaw. The advantage of making them is that they can be clocked to my spindle to be as true as my spindle is.

I've always just made them for one specific application, but I like the steps in the photo you attached. I'll be making mine oversize from now on and adding steps to increase their versatility. I could literally make a half dozen or so to cover a large range of sizes.

Thank you for posting that!

 

[Tom Kitta]

Yeah I have few step chucks that came with 5C lots. They seem to be mostly for people that either do production or work with same size parts - so camera filters etc. would seem to work well. I would classify this more as a fixture type - i.e. specific to the actual job at hand, given rather low reusability due to tiny grip range.

This is similar to the soft jaws idea - where you can cut the jaws exactly to the shape you need. If you do this well - I think you can get excellent accuracy. For thin walled stuff I guess it would be pie jaws - that are soft jaws that grab on larger area.

In a home shop we rarely work on small production runs - fixture use is not high when compared to production shops. Through I use fixtures on a milling machine - don't remember if I ever used a fixture on a lathe.

 

[Mcgyver]

Production or emergcy, lets you make what you need it to be. I've not seen machined steps for 5C (doesn't mean they don't exist though), but the Schuablins above are factory steps and for general use. A complete set has each one with say four sizes and the sizes sort of leap frog each other. e.g. the set might offer1mm increments, but each step might be 4mm from the adjacent step.

Anyway, nothing stopping one from buying emergency ones and machining a set of stepped collets. KBC sells each blank say $60, not free, but not stupid either. There is probably a smallish range or number of sizes that would handle most camera stuff ...... if the griping distance was sufficient. I use my Schaublins often enough I wish I had a complete set, but kind of dont want to know the price lol

 

[PeterT]

I drew up some plans to make soft jaws, but I coincidentally stumbled on these on Ebay. Typically they are mounted & machined for purpose for unique holding or production runs, but my plan is to modify the face to accommodate mounting my own sacrificial plate stock, basically extending the life indefinitely. (Envision say 1/4" plate stock screwed to the face of RH picture). My projects also require skinny little rings of soft alloys & this is a better holding method. With soft jaws It matters much less if its only 3 jaws because you are machining the fixture in-situ so its very close to perfect & much more clamping area vs singular jaws. Soft jaws also provide the opportunity to machine a ledge or backstop which provides axial support & makes fixturing & repeatability much easier. The caveat is shipping from this seller to Canada is ridiculous. I had another Ebay package arriving to my USA re-shipper & that made it worthwhile.

 

[kstrauss]

I would love to have soft jaws for my Pratt-Burnerd GripTru but I've never seen the two part jaws for my chuck. Harold Hall has instructions (http://www.homews.co.uk/page99a.html) using a special jig and rotary table. I'm thinking that CNC would be far less effort. Has anyone made their own jaws?